combustion user –> flame artist

[the_box]

Hey all,

I was wondering is anyone had any suggestions for a combustion user looking to become a flame artist. I’ve been working with combustion for a few years now, and I’m looking to step up to the “big box.” I read a post where somesone wrote that convincing someone to let you sit at the flame was the first step…I’m finding that to be VERY true. I also read that it’s hard to learn the tool without the tool…which is also true. Granted there are training dvd’s and such that could provide for several wonderful evenings in front of the television “learing” how to use a machine that you may never ACTUALLY have the chance to operate. That being said: does anyone have any suggestions on how I (or any combustion user) could make the leap from combustion to flame?

baby steps right?

thanks
-b

[uwe_wiesemann]

Hi,
too bad you are not in cologne, germany… This question is almost never asked here.
You have to be really good at what you do on C. Offer to do assisting jobs on Combustion and ask to be there when your elemnts (setups, or whatever) are used for finishing on flame. Eventually they’ll let you do that yourself.
Also make sure you know your way around editing with C and/or other apps.
Editing, although not exactly a specialty on Flame is taken for granted and you you’ll have to do it from day 1. Learn about tape formats and how to use the machines. It doesnt make sense to work on Flame and not be able to at least load and playout to Videotape.
We had a freelancer once who wouldnt archive his jobs, so I had to do it the next morning… ridiculous…
As a last tip. Dont be ignorant and say “that can be done on my Combustion easier..” all day (even if you are right sometimes). There are so many people out there who tend to believe they can do everything on their home-pc, but when it comes to deadlines and contracts they actually get sick….
hope that helped a little

regards
Uwe Wiesemann

[-k]

greetings from cologne too…

from a more technical side…
although you will that a few modules are similar (or almost identical) and that a few buttons are arranges similar to flame, you will see that still flame and combustion are totally different.
Main difference is that combustion has a timeline /layer centred approach, whereas flame is generally spoken clip orientated. This of cource is just a generalisation, cause there is also a typical scematic in flame (batch) and “action” is also sort of layer based but its still completely different to Cs scematic or layered Workspace and pretty much different to any desktop app…
Of course the main thing is being a good compositor so I’d say knowing combustion does not necessarily make the jump that much easier than being good in after effects for instance.

kai

[Anonymous]

Something else to keep in mind about being a flame/inferno artist is the stress level inherent to the position. You need to be able to work well under pressure–that means tight deadlines, and clients breathing down your neck while they look over your shoulder and change their mind every twenty minutes.

You need certain personality skills in addition to any technical/artistic skills in order to sit in the Big Chair. It’s not as if a post house will lock you in a little room by yourself and let you play with the big, expensive toy all day. They have to make that big, expensive toy pay for itself, and that means charging $600 an hour or more to clients, who can be very demanding. When clients are paying that much, they have earned the right to be picky and to look over your shoulder. They can also be really annoying, but they have paid for the privelege. Can you deal with it? Do you know your toolset well enough to make the work move along as quickly as possible, so that the client can say “yes, that’s perfect,” or “no, that’s not right at all” before they take a coffee break?

It’s hard enough for clients to understand/accept rendering time, as they expect everything to happen in real time. They won’t feel comfortable if it appears that it’s taking you a long time to figure out how to do something. They’re not paying you to learn on their time, they want you to finish the shot as soon as possible so they won’t have to pay one dollar more than is necessary. There may be clients who are laid back and will let you do your thing in a relatively low-stress manner, but don’t expect that as a rule.

In summary, being a flame/inferno artist means being part diplomat, part technician, part artist, and part magician. There’s probably other things one could throw into the mix as well, but suffice to say that simply posessing the necessary technical skill and artistic talent isn’t a guarantee of success.

-zolo

[Deke]

zolo wrote:

In summary, being a flame/inferno artist means being part diplomat, part technician, part artist, and part magician. There’s probably other things one could throw into the mix as well, but suffice to say that simply posessing the necessary technical skill and artistic talent isn’t a guarantee of success.

-zolo

You forgot mindreader 🙂

[Anonymous]

dekekincaid wrote:

zolo wrote:

In summary, being a flame/inferno artist means being part diplomat, part technician, part artist, and part magician. There’s probably other things one could throw into the mix as well, but suffice to say that simply posessing the necessary technical skill and artistic talent isn’t a guarantee of success.

-zolo

You forgot mindreader 🙂

You’re right, that should have been first on the list! I also thought of “miracle worker,” but I guess “magician” is close enough…

😀

-zolo

[Anonymous]

zolo wrote:

dekekincaid wrote:

zolo wrote:

In summary, being a flame/inferno artist means being part diplomat, part technician, part artist, and part magician. There’s probably other things one could throw into the mix as well, but suffice to say that simply posessing the necessary technical skill and artistic talent isn’t a guarantee of success.

-zolo

You forgot mindreader 🙂

You’re right, that should have been first on the list! I also thought of “miracle worker,” but I guess “magician” is close enough…

😀

-zolo

You forgot you need the patience of a saint or at least mahatma ghandi…when dealing with unreasonable clients. 😆

[MarkH]

Hi there. Autodesk Toxik is more like flame than combustion is. The workflow of combustion is great although I’m guessing you want to learn flame so you can apply for a job as a flame operator. Unfortunately it doesn’t work this way.

combustion is a great app though. For back-end compositing I choose it over any of the other software now. Ever tried using a Wacom in After Effects? Yikes! It’s a bit tedious. With combustion I can do everything on the Wacom. A lot of the studios doing television-series work use combustion more and more. I know of a few studios doing prime-time television work and all the compositing is done in combustion. Jarod from Zoic just released a couple DVD videos with Desktop Images on using Lightwave and combustion together.

Getting back to flame, you need access to flame system to really know it. You work with clips and reels rather than a timeline. It also helps to have someone who knows flame to help you get started. Good luck!

[Anonymous]

kuban altan built some great get you going flame dvd’s for cmivfx.

you should go and get them. Save you a fortune in other training in the long run.

link is http://www.cmivfx.com/dvd_flame.asp

-nv

[birail]

MarkH wrote:

Hi there. Autodesk Toxik is more like flame than combustion is.

Is anybody know if there is Paint and Text in Toxik ?
thnx
chris

[nanuk]

1eyejack wrote:

zolo wrote:

dekekincaid wrote:

zolo wrote:

In summary, being a flame/inferno artist means being part diplomat, part technician, part artist, and part magician. There’s probably other things one could throw into the mix as well, but suffice to say that simply posessing the necessary technical skill and artistic talent isn’t a guarantee of success.

-zolo

You forgot mindreader 🙂

You’re right, that should have been first on the list! I also thought of “miracle worker,” but I guess “magician” is close enough…

😀

-zolo

You forgot you need the patience of a saint or at least mahatma ghandi…when dealing with unreasonable clients. 😆

and entertainer 😉

You have to ask your client if his last party was good, or talking about the weather or so. And work on FFI as fast as possible at the same time. A fireoperator told me once, why he chooses to do film. He don´t want to work with an shotgun fully loaded to his neck! And there is some truth in it, i guess.
I also did the step to the big chair from combustion. Another thing that confused me at the first time sitting on Inferno was alpha channel/premultipling. Cause that is totaly diffrent working with the big guns compaired to C*. Without sitting on FFI it is nearly impossible to learn it. The company i work for first made me a trainee. So i had to do all the archiving, preparing jobs for seniors and so on. Then putting me in nightshift for bigger jobs. And that is quiet cool. Because in the night there is not that much pressure. Because clients don´t sit next to you at night.
Perhaps you can find a company, that will let do you

[nanuk]

birail wrote:

MarkH wrote:

Hi there. Autodesk Toxik is more like flame than combustion is.

Is anybody know if there is Paint and Text in Toxik ?
thnx
chris

No, not jet.

Cheers Nanuk

[Author]

Posts