Flame – Should I stay, or should I go?

[cross]

I have been running a Flame for 8 years now, it’s a little old 7.0.3 on an Octane and time to upgrade, with HD hopefully. I like the Flame but the upgrade is a pricy, like 100K or so last time I checked. That being said, I am being pushed to look at other options, like a souped up PC or MAC with AE/Motion/Shake/Nuke… So my questions are:

If money wasn’t an issue, which road is the best, stay on Flame or not?

If money is an issue, then what’s the best choice?

Anyone know what a really killer desktop system really does cost after you’ve added all the bells and whistles?

Any options or opinions would be great! Thanks!

[uwe_wiesemann]

Hi,
I suppose everybody will say that its a very difficult question.
I noticed, that a lot of the jobs I am working on lately dont really require a flame (ok, I have a flint, but its is similar….). Hey could be done using desktop-systems, like AE, Combustion, Motion and shake. Also, because there was no client breathing into my neck… If most of your (companys) income is made with the flame charged to the client by the hour, th decision can alost be made with a calculator….
In terms of workflow, hopping between desktop-applications is sometimes a drag, though. The FFI system is kind of a one-stop in comparison.

best regards

Uwe Wiesemann

[kalthans]

agreed, that is a very difficult thing to address. just about everything depends on your workflow and how much time you will be spending w/ clients in the room.

keep in mind that even though flame is an incredible package capable of delivering stellar results quickly and by one artist there is an upper limit on the sophistication of the things you can pull off. i’m discovering more and more that stand-alone, task-specific desktop apps can often (usually?) deliver equal or better results. case in point: Boujou. granted it is the cadillac of 3d tracking apps, but when you compare the amount of time you spend in Boujou generating meaningful data vs. what you can get out of FI in the same amount of time…….

another case in point: the new ImageBasedKeyer from d2/Nuke is simply crazy….i’ve been a ardent proponent of MK since i’ve been on Flame, but if i had the choice i’d do all my keying in IBK/Nuke now….

if you’re in a situation where you don’t need to have the blazing interactivity that FFI/FS offers then i’d seriously consider shifting to a suite of task-specific applications. the number of shops out there turning out A-list work using solely desktop apps is already above critical mass i believe.

another thing to keep in mind: high-bitdepth workflow. FFI is still lagging when it comes to using EXR, float, half and other high-range sources.

and, if interactivity is a sometimes-issue for your shop consider building a souped-up desktop box. Apps like Fusion5 offer both network-rendering and cluster-processing, which when paired with attached high-speed storage and SDI or HD-SDI cards pushes them into the same arena as FFI for less money. sparks (plugins) for those systems are a LOT less than the same sparks on FFI…take a look at Sapphire….

you’ll need to pry the FFI stylus from my cold, dead fingers….but if i was writing checks for the tools i use i’d be contemplating the same shift as you!

just my 2c

good luck!

k

[eltopo]

Gee indeed difficuilt. So the specific apps is actually a good idea plus it might be a better invesment. Having multiple programmes in the same machine at the same time is actually incredible. At this very moment Photoshop and AE are working at the same time.

So do you know how to work on shake / nuke because when you change to other app work at first can be very tricky until you star to get the programme.

[Anonymous]

IMO, It is def a tough choice but I think you should try and spend some time on a Flame 9.5 before making any decisions. They have really progressed nicely since 7.6, adding lots of nice features here and there.

Also keep in mind the amount of hardware and “stand alone” products you will need to buy to match the versitility of the flames.

For me I spend alot of time working with digibeta footage, in conforms and using other. I have yet to find a solution that integrates editing and compositing as well as the flame does. Most of the desktop compositors are setup for film, so this kind of thing is an afterthought.

Although I will say that I have been playing with several desktop apps and some of them are really coming along nicely. Take a look at fusion and nuke. I think they might be the wave of the future.

[uwe_wiesemann]

Quote:

Also keep in mind the amount of hardware and “stand alone” products you will need to buy to match the versitility of the flames.

Hi. If you stay in SD, the extra hardware is almost nothing. An external firewire/usb2-disk is already fast enough for recording and playout, when using a cheap (but good) Blackmagic-Decklink card. For extra security you can get a raid. The capturing/playout-tool comes with the card.
I am still amazed that it works so good.
And… no I dont work for them…

regards

Uwe Wiesemann

[Author]

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